Episode 64: Data, Dispensaries, and Dollars: Maximizing Cannabis Marketing ROI

Emily Wells  00:12

Hey there cannabis marketing community. I’m Emily wells the membership manager here at cannabis Marketing Association, and you’re tuned in to another exciting episode of Party Lake marketer Today’s guest is Keri Branch. Keri is a dynamic and accomplished marketing professional with over 15 years experience in developing and executing data driven marketing strategies that effectively drive revenue and brand awareness in both high profile and startup organizations. Carrie is a seasoned marketing professional with extensive experience in and outside of the cannabis industry before joining pa options for wellness as Director of Marketing, she was the wholesale Marketing Manager at INSA cannabis and the Senior Marketing Manager at ethos cannabis at INSA Carrie developed marketing plans for wholesale operations in Pennsylvania and Massachusetts. During her tenure at ethos, she launched in house brands and contributed to the company’s expansion from two locations to a multi state operator with 15 dispensaries across Pennsylvania, Maryland, Massachusetts and Ohio. Carries background also includes roles in retail, tourism and property management, as well as summer programs at prestigious universities like the University of Pennsylvania, Villanova and Yale. Currently, she oversees marketing for PA options for wellness, which operates six dispensaries and a 65,000 square foot grow facility in Pennsylvania. The company is a clinical registrant partnered with Penn State College of Medicine, and was the first to receive approval for troaches and temple balls, products beneficial to MediCal patients in Pennsylvania, Carrie attended Montgomery County Community College and Holy Family college holds several marketing certifications and is recognized for her community involvement. Thanks so much for being here today, Keri, we can’t wait to learn from you.

Lisa Buffo  01:55

Okay, welcome everybody to today’s episode of Party like a marketer, the podcast dedicated to cannabis marketing, public relations and authentic storytelling. Today’s guest is Carrie branch, who is the Director of Marketing at Vital options, which is a cannabis business in Pennsylvania. Carrie, thank you so much for joining us at the show.

Keri Branch  02:15

Thank you so much. I’m so happy to be here.

Lisa Buffo  02:17

Yes, I’m really glad to have you. We’ve had you in the CMA community for a long time now, and I know you are a cannabis industry veteran. You know a whole lot about marketing the space. You’ve worked for license holders of various sizes, and I love speaking with the folks who work for license holders directly, because you really do understand in a like your boots on the ground. You really do understand in the most frontline way, what is going on. And you’re in Pennsylvania, which is an emerging market, as well as the whole kind of mid Atlantic, eastern seaboard, Midwest as well. Like there’s so much happening out there. So I’m excited to hear your perspective on that. But first, can you just introduce yourself to us, to the audience, tell us a little bit about what it is that you do, how you got to the cannabis industry and your professional background. Absolutely

Keri Branch  03:09

So, as you stated on the Director of Marketing at Vital options, we are a single state operator in Pennsylvania with six dispensaries and a grow and a very healthy wholesale business across the state, so well known for our mood and solventless brands and our dispensaries, what I do with them, responsible for the strategy and implementation for our retail and wholesale marketing strategies, as well as our branding, for brands we hold and the Digital Marketing Strategy and Outreach to our patients across the state, and just helping them to get familiar with our products, our dispensaries, and hopefully converting them to join our medical programs in the state. By experience, I do have 15 plus years of marketing experience prior to joining cannabis industry, and I have been in cannabis for almost five years now, as you stated, I’ve been with a couple different license holders. So I actually started with those cannabis and was with them for about three years as they were in their initial growth stages. So when I started with them, they had just one two dispensaries, and I was with them as they went through their growth phase to almost 13 across four states. So it’s a very exciting time to be with them and to help them go through that transitioned and was with into cannabis for a short while before finding my place here at Vital options. So it was nice to be able to have that experience across the different brands. They each had a different footprint. Two out of three were MSOs that held properties in Pennsylvania, Massachusetts, Maryland, Ohio, Connecticut and Florida. So it definitely helps to give me a different perspective of the cannabis industry, how it can work, what our you know, different resources are as we do, different. Programs and campaigns in this highly regulated market.

Lisa Buffo  05:04

And are you from the Philadelphia area originally?

Keri Branch  05:07

I am, yes. Okay, cool.

Lisa Buffo  05:10

And are there those other businesses based there, or, I know you said there and all those other markets, but like was your day to day in Bucks County?

Keri Branch  05:20

So ethos was actually based out of Philadelphia. Although a good portion of our corporate office, we had a handful in Philadelphia, we had some in Chicago, we had a good portion in Massachusetts. That was a good healthy portion of our business inta was actually based in Massachusetts. So while my home office was in Pennsylvania, and I worked out of here, I did spend a good bit of time up in the Massachusetts market for both inta and ethos.

Lisa Buffo  05:51

Okay, cool, that makes sense. Okay. Well, I would love to dive into more about the challenges that you face, things you’ve learned, and kind of get the audience a better understanding of that. But first, could you actually just kind of give some context to the Pennsylvania market? Like, do you know how many patients are there? What makes it different from any of the markets like that you’ve operated in before? Like, can we just talk a little bit about Pennsylvania, and then we’ll talk about what it means to operate means to operate and market in that space, how, however you want to interpret that question.

Keri Branch  06:26

Sure. So Pennsylvania is a slightly different market. We are very highly regulated. I would say the closest to us. For anybody who works in this market or in the Northeast market, will often draw the of the comparison between Ohio and the Board of Pharmacy who oversees there. Here in Pennsylvania, we’re overseen by the Department of Health, and they just are very strict in this being a medical market um, so the rules and regulations that we do have to follow are very, very different in regards to marketing operations, everything we do down to the products that we are allowed to sell. So we’re one of the few markets that still are not allowed to have edibles or pre rolls or anything that can be combusted. So it definitely presents some different challenges in what we can do, from product mix, down to the different types of advertising that we can do and where those rules and regulations are. We are also still one of the few med only states on the east coast at this point every especially with Ohio last week, going recreational, we are now bordered on every side by states that are recreational, we are the only holdout that is met only. So it definitely presents a different set of challenges for us as we are taking a look at what our plans are, and it’s really shortened our timeline. So I think any marketer, whether you’re coming from within the cannabis space or you’re coming from, you know, retail or anything into the cannabis space you’re used to planning, you know, whether it’s your campaigns, your budgets, anything like that. You know, we’d love to do it six to 12 months out, right? And I think when you move into cannabis, you’re much shorter, you know, one to three. Hopefully you can get it out to six months. But for us in Pennsylvania, I think we’re looking at a much shorter window now because so much is changing so quickly, and so we’re really, even if you’ve got it planned that far out, you’re really shortening that window because of so much changing. It’s like the ground is shifting under us day by day. And what could all of it mean? What is rescheduling going to mean? You know, is that going to affect 280 is it going to affect budgets? Is it going to affect us in Pennsylvania if the rescheduling goes through, and is that going to switch us to recreational? And how quickly could that happen? We have legislation that’s up that could just change our state recreational so there’s a lot of stuff that we’re monitoring on a day to day basis to see how it’s going to impact impact us, and where it’s going to impact us, whether it’s going to be, you know, budgets, marketing, product mix, there’s just, there’s so much that could change so quickly. Here

Lisa Buffo  09:11

is there a path for Pennsylvania with adult use like, how do you how? How does that factor into your planning, short term and medium term? Because I know that that is sort of overlaying with, you know, rescheduling. We’ve got the election coming up like we I think all of us today’s conversation in August, and whatever conversation we’re going to be having in December could be completely different. So how can you just talk a little bit about that, and maybe how that what are the conversations you’re having internally, and how does that impact your your marketing, given that short possible changes in a really short period of time,

Keri Branch  09:45

absolutely, I can speak for what we’re doing at at Vital options, right? Everyone, I think, is looking at it a little bit differently, but I think all of us within the market are ready for it to happen within a short period of time. I can tell you that. But a year ago, when I was here for just two, three months after I joined the company, we were already saying, what is this going to mean and how quickly could this happen? So we’ve already put a year into the planning of what it could mean for adult use and how quickly it could happen. We have paid attention to what’s happened in Maryland and how quickly they flipped. And then we’ve also paid attention to how long it took other states to flip, like New Jersey and Ohio. And we’re very aware of the fact that Pennsylvania could go either way. We know that in legislature, they’re talking about, you know, and I’m not sure if you’re familiar with how Pennsylvania’s liquor stores operate their state run program. So yeah, so the way it works here, the state owns that and runs those stores. And so there is talk, and there’s a legislation that’s up that says, Well, maybe when adult use comes, that’s how we run the dispensaries. And so there’s not a lot of us in the industry that would like to see that happen. We don’t necessarily like heavily. Necessarily like the liquor store to run. There’s just certain rules and regulations about how they do. And we’d like to see it be, you know, open retail, but it’s a possibility, and it’s something we’re talking about without interstate commerce. We don’t think it can be really successful plan, but that’s from us who have been doing this for so many years now and kind of prepping this, but it is something that’s being talked about at that level. And for the rest of us, we’re prepping for what it could mean. What we’ve seen happen in other states where once the adult use gets flipped, how are we planning? How is it going to impact the product that we have and have available and that increased demand. How is it going to affect our menus? And are we going to be prepared to offer a medical and adult use? How is it? How’s our marketing prepared? And are we ready to flip over and say that we are welcoming? We’ve been a very med first, only company. So last year, we really started opening up that branding and what that meant, and really saying that while we are a clinical registrant within the state of PA, we do want to make sure that our marketing has started saying we are really open to everybody. And so you are a med patient now, but you’re a customer first, and we want you to feel welcome here. We want you to know that we’re here for anybody who has questions, and if you’re kind of curious, and we’re going to help walk you through that process. And so we really started putting that plan in place last year. We’re happy with the results we’ve seen from it already, and we think it’s really going to have laid the groundwork for us for once, adult use comes. I

Lisa Buffo  12:37

love that. I love that idea of opening up the branding and the conversation and pivoting with these anticipatory changes, also knowing that a brand and messaging change can take a year or two for it to really land, and for, I think, folks, to respond to it when you’re talking about the longer term horizon. So that’s that that’s really cool, that you guys are doing that, and that that’s that’s been working. But thank you for describing Pennsylvania. I did not know that about the liquor stores. And that is interesting, because if that does happen, I don’t think there is a precedent here in the US where there’s any other state that does that so similar. I mean, Canada does, but I I I think that would be a first, as far as I’m aware, but that would definitely be interesting. So we’ll, we’ll see how that plays out. But that being said, can you talk about, let’s first talk about the challenges, and then we can get into the success and what you do and how it does work. But given it is so medical, focused and forward, first, what are some of the challenges that you face in this environment for marketing?

Keri Branch  13:46

So I think one of the biggest challenges that we have in the state is our seed sales system. We’re one of the few in as far as I know, one of the few in the country that our Department of Health requires us to use MJ Freeway, which MJ Freeway is something that gets used by other states, but we’re required to use it in a way that doesn’t allow integrations from our other partners. So it actually restricts a lot of the information that as marketers we really would like to have that allows us to really look at the analytics and how successful campaigns can be, and it really impacts us on a retail side and on the marketing side, and it’s something we’ve been working with the Department of Health and others to really unlock that and make sure that They know that it can be used compliantly. And HIPAA compliant, but still in a way that can be useful and allow the businesses to understand their business and what’s happening from an analytical perspective and use it to grow in that compliant way. So that’s something I think it’s very unique challenge, and like. Even as you’re onboarding new partners that you want to work with you, I have found you have to be very, very careful, because they’ll say, Yes, we we work with it. You know? We work with MJ Freeway. We integrate with them. Yes, we have other clients in PA. And you’ll get to the stage where you’re signing a contract, and then they go, Wait, you don’t, we can’t integrate with them. No, this is no good, and you’ve got a signed contract and and you’re sitting there with your hands in there, and nobody knows what to do. And it happened at multiple companies like I’ve it’s, it’s really difficult, so you’ve got to be very aware of what they do. Contracts in, I think the cannabis space do not always have a well defined statement of terms. And I think that’s something else that needs to be improved, just in our job, you know, in our industry in general, that I’m used to seeing from my past, my experience. So being able to have that and kind of work that into our industry, I think, is going to improve those contracts and improve what we’re doing and allow people to be better prepared. But I think also continuing to work with the DOH, and continuing to either move on from MJ Freeway or to move into something where they allow us to integrate in a better way, to connect those things that aren’t is going to help us. We’ve been able to work with partners that can connect in a better way to let us see a portion that allows us to operate better. One of the benefits that we have is about 90% of our transactions do take place on our E commerce platform. So orders are placed before they ever step into the store, and that really helps to merge a lot of that data, but you still complete the transaction in store, and so seeing what they’re doing and being able to feed that back into your system, to be able to segment audiences for your messaging, it’s just so important, and there’s still such a roadblock there that it just presents a really unique set of challenges that as a marketer, you’ve really got to be on top of it to know what’s happening and What you can do to help fix the gaps, and

Lisa Buffo  17:02

is it the state that doesn’t allow the integrations? And like, Is there concern data privacy? Is that why?

Keri Branch  17:08

Yeah, HIPAA compliance and data privacy.

Lisa Buffo  17:11

Okay, okay, that makes sense. Well, that’s definitely a big challenge, because that essentially, what that translates to is you have a data desert of information, where you you are trying to make informed decisions, but and in theory, should be able to, but can’t. And yeah, that that’s definitely a problem. So that’s interesting, that that’s how that’s playing out. So what are some of the ways that you remediate that or solve that. Like, what are the best practices for operating within a I’ll just use the word data desert. Like, how do you it’s great you’ve got all this on E commerce. Like, do you over rely on that? Or, how do you piece together the information you have to get the information you need to keep taking steps forward. Like, how what’s the solve for that?

Keri Branch  17:59

So we’ve been able to find partners that can connect in different ways. We do rely on some of the Commerce Data. We also rely on our connections in Google Analytics that will connect some of the pieces as well. And so honestly, I will give credit to the partners that we work with that have been able to connect some of those pieces that will give us the analytics that we need. Surfside has been an incredible partner that’s been able to get us more analytics than we have from anywhere else as well as Alpine IQ, they connect in great ways that can just open that up and give us more of what we need, and has allowed us to segment audiences and see the data in new ways that we’ve really needed, and it’s worked with other systems that we have in place, and it’s just allowed us to grow campaigns and see where we’re successful and where we need to improve. And it’s really brought in new audiences and allowed us to bring audiences back that maybe we needed to re engage with and move forward with them, and bring them back into the dispensaries to see additional sales and revenue from them.

Lisa Buffo  19:07

That’s awesome. Yeah. And can you just briefly explain what Surfside and alpine IQ are, for those who don’t know?

Keri Branch  19:14

Sure. So Surfside is a digital advertising company, and we work with them for our programmatic advertising, we were able to work with them even just starting slow. We are a smaller organization, so we were able to bring on board three dispensaries with digital programmatic advertising. And as we saw good results and return on ad spend or row as we were able then to talk to our C suite and bring on additional dispensaries, and so we’re in the process of expanding that with them, which is really exciting. And Alpine IQ is who we use for our text messaging and email. We moved to them from Spring big and it’s been such an improvement in our messaging, in the delivery. Rates have gone up, which is fantastic for us, as well as our click throughs and open rates have all improved since we’ve started working with them. They have better analytics than our prior partner, and they really work with us to help improve that, which for us, like the RE engagement campaigns that we’ve worked for and the better segmented audiences have just really, really improved since we started working with them. Helps keep costs down, but to really know that you are engaging with that audience, and being able to look at each campaign from an analytical perspective and say what’s working and what’s not has really allowed us to put together a couple campaigns and target either specific programs that we want to talk to our audience about that we know that they’re looking to hear about, or, you know, highlight a specific brand, you know that we know we’re doing a promotion, or, you know, something like that with and get that information out to the audience.

Lisa Buffo  20:56

Yeah, that that’s it. Also, what I hear you saying is it’s important that these tools are interesting and can work on their own, right, whether it’s email or text or programmatic, but you also need whomever is facilitating those, whether it’s an account manager or someone internally, to be able to actually understand what they’re saying and interpret that data and make decisions from it, and be able to adjust and pivot so that it can be scaled and continue to show results. Because you can’t just launch it right away and expect like, oh, it’s, you know, we’ll do this for 60 or 90 days and it’s immediately going to work. Sometimes that’s the case, and that’s great. But you also are getting that baseline of information, and that baseline of information helps you take it to becoming more informed and helping to scale up your efforts. So it sounds like those partners are effectively doing that and helping to take the information they have and the data they have, make sense of it, and use that in a way that is helpful for you and at smart too. How you mentioned just doing a phased approach, like let’s start with a few locations, make sure it works, get that information, and then from there, scale that up. That’s a general marketing best practice, but certainly when you have limited budget and there’s a lot of different factors at play, really important step to make sure you’re starting off on the right foot. And you had mentioned so you’ve got these different locations. They’re in different areas. We had talked a little bit about product mix, which I want to get back to in a minute. But and then we’re also talking programmatic, you know, row as bottom of funnel, but I kind of want to talk top of funnel too. So what from a brand awareness perspective, I’m not sure how competitive being market is exactly where you are and how you describe that, and what that scene is, but maybe speak to that. But overall, what I’m trying to get at is what like creative strategies do you use for brand, brand awareness, given that you do have multiple locations and are pretty limited in terms of how you can talk about and where you can talk about your products and and does programmatic fit into that? I’ve heard like mixed opinions, whether people think, oh, programmatic the bottom of funnel thing or top of funnel thing. But tell talk to me about brand awareness and your approach to that given your stores. So

Keri Branch  23:18

I will say, just to give kind of a lay of the land. It is a pretty competitive market in Pennsylvania. So we see, I would see, some of the differences that we see here is, and especially, I would say, right now, the change that we have seen in the market is like, there’s been a slowdown in sales of premium eights, but we have seen smalls and ground flower sales for those categories have shot up. And we know that part of that is because pre rolls aren’t available in the market. So it is really just shot up the demand for ground and for larger sizes being available. So that’s those are kind of insights that we can get from, you know, what we’re seeing and react to that. And we have been so for us that brand awareness of making sure that our audience knows that those products are available for us. And we use that as brand awareness as well. So we use a multi tiered approach, obviously, which you would hope that if you’re able to do, or if anybody’s able to do, you can do that, we promote it in store. So if you’re in you’re seeing what other products that we have available. We do that through in store, TV advertising. We work with a partner called see TV, and they basically scrape our menus, and then we can create advertising through AI or banner creative that we do, and it’ll rotate through that on screen, which I think is a really creative way to use some of those TVs that were built into dispensaries and then kind of became their own advertising desert because marketing teams got caught back, you know, cut back, and nobody had the time to do it. This is essentially allowing us as a small team, marketing team of two within our organization. It. Gives us a partner to work with that allows us to do that without really much manpower or hours behind it, because the AI works with us. And again, we have a good partner and a good account manager that’s helping walk us through that and optimize it as best as we can. So we’re doing that in store, and then we also promote it outside. So I do think that programmatic advertising plays a part in that. We use the programmatic advertising, the digital ads, that we’re doing, to promote not only the locations, but the brands and products that we have. So featuring those products within those ads helps attract customers based on what we know they’re shopping and looking for so we’ll rotate through images of the products that we offer and the ones that we know are the hottest sellers at that time, and we can react pretty quickly to that and change the ads if we’re seeing changes in the sales data that is coming in. So to me, being able to react and change that pretty quickly makes a difference being able to get out there. I think one of the other things we’re excited to see come to PA to make a difference in that as well, is some of the menu advertising that Jane offers. I heart Jane, where you can either promote it on your own menu or work with some of your wholesale partners, where you’re wholesaling the flower to bring it to the top of menu. That’s something else that is starting to make a bigger dent in Pennsylvania as well, to bring about more brand awareness. Honestly, it’s something we struggle with at Vital options, and it’s something we’re working on over the next year, we have one of our biggest brands. It’s one of our biggest challenges, honestly, is our brand of flower, the brand name is not on the packaging. That was one of the challenges that I walked into when I got here. We’re hoping to finally have that remedy with some new packaging that’ll be out later this year, but it’s it’s definitely taken us some time to get there, so we hope to do some good brand awareness around that with the new packaging that releases later this year. So it’s always an uphill battle, no matter where you are, but it’s seeing what you have to work with, what your challenges are, kind of assessing that, and then moving forward with the plan on how to fix it. So we’re hopeful that we’ll do that. And I think pop ups in our state are a big thing. Some states are, you know, really successful with it. In Pennsylvania, I think it’s a community thing. So our patients really enjoy coming out and seeing that, but what we see on the tail end, and how we try and set them up, even with the brands who come in and do the pop ups at our location, is there’s got to be a plan to it. And we get a lot of feedback from the brands who work with us that if they come in, we make sure, a week or two beforehand, there’s product in stock. When they come to do the pop up, we have a promotion set up so that when the brand ambassador is there, there is a sale to support what they’re doing there, their product is on the menu and highlighted. So for us, it’s all about sell through, whether it’s them or whether it’s us, whoever’s doing the pop up, there is a purpose to it. It’s not just somebody coming out doing it. We really want to promote the sell through of what they have on the menu. And so for us, it creates an educational opportunity for patients, and it also works from a brand awareness standpoint, and then also to sell through the product. So couple different things that we really try and do to help get the word out there for whether it’s our brand or someone else, to help with the sell through and brand awareness. Yeah,

Lisa Buffo  28:30

it seems like partnerships are, have always been, and continue to be so important and key in this space. It’s definitely not a can do things alone. And one thing we have found within our own research at CMA is for for folks like you, and honestly, everybody, cannabis is a B to B to C experience all products, they don’t go direct to consumer. They have to go through a retailer. So brands have to be strong enough that retailers want to carry them, and then they have to also sell what sell well at the point of reach, at the point of sale, and retailers are building relationships with consumers and customers, and brands are building relationships with consumers and customers. So there is a natural, well, it’s just an interesting kind of different way to shop, because there’s really no other products out there where you have to go, like, I can’t think of anything. I could be wrong, but anything else in the real world where you have to go to a store for it, you can even get like Home Services at Costco, right? There’s like everything you can do online these days, or get it shipped to get it shipped directly. But there’s always such that harmony between brands and retailers. So I like to hear that it’s working, and that that there’s a lot of partnership there that can particularly help the patients and the customers, because they get to learn something and get a deal and feel really positive when they walk out of the store. And I want to hear too more about your product mix. So Pennsylvania doesn’t have pre rolls. They don’t have edibles, like what what is selling there? What are the hot do? Products and, yeah, like to talk to me about that. How does that play into your marketing strategy? I’m like, flower is the highest selling thing anywhere, and pre rolls are, I mean, pre rolls and edibles are, like top two. So like, what what do you do? What’s the mix and how do you change things? So

Keri Branch  30:16

saying we don’t have edibles is a little deceiving. So we don’t have edibles. However, I will say vital options was the company to be bring trophies to Pennsylvania. And if you’ve never heard that term before, it’s the term for a soft lozenge. It’s a before Maryland actually had it before edibles were legal in their state. So we brought that to market two, almost three years ago, once that entered in, basically, it is a gelatin. You know, I don’t want to say gummy, because it’s not supposed to be a gummy, but it is meant to be dissolved in your mouth sublingually, and the benefit to that is medicinally, you let it dissolve in your mouth so beautifully it does absorb and does not get digested and go through your liver. So it’s a quicker uptake, and it will you’ll get more of the medicine. So it’s a quicker uptake into your system, and you don’t lose as much of it through your digestive tract and through your liver. So there is a benefit to it medicinally, but it did definitely open the floodgates to those that had a gummy like edible in other markets that were able to adapt their recipes and bring them in. So the Pennsylvania market has definitely opened up, and now you will see many more of them under ingestibles or trophies on the menu. So we definitely have that on the menu, which has been a huge help. And I think the patients have really enjoyed having that at Vital options. We’re always trying to kind of take a look at what the audience is looking for. So back in April, we also brought temple balls to Pennsylvania. It’s a legacy product. You see it mainly out in California. Not a ton of people have done it. It’s a style of hash that Frenchy cannoli had really made popular and started bringing back. It was hugely popular. We actually did a drop for it for 420 it was so popular, we brought it back for 710, and now it’s kind of becoming a staple on the menu. So temple balls. Have you ever seen them or heard of them? No,

Lisa Buffo  32:33

I’m very familiar with Frenchie, but I’ve not had a temple ball that I’ve at least if I did, it wasn’t called that.

Keri Branch  32:42

It’s pretty amazing. It’s you take the hash of the and they roll it into just this shiny ball, and it gets eight, and it creates a crust. And you will then you don’t dab it, you would crack it open after it’s been aged and sold to a patient, that you open up the ball and you can add it to certain flour, not that you would combust it, yeah, but it almost creates that infused thing that you would consume. We’ll call it that, yeah. But it sounds like cheese

Lisa Buffo  33:19

aged and sprinkled. It’s like, that sounds great. And

Keri Branch  33:23

they’re they’re beautiful. The smell is amazing. We’ve got another lot that are dropping in just a couple weeks. But our we’re really popular for our solventless concentrate brand, and this is just another addition to that that those that are really dedicated to our solidless brand. Have just really loved and it really is for experienced users in the concentrate market. But if that is what you love, or if you’re looking for something that’s a little bit more higher potency, this is something that you can really enjoy, and we’ve gotten such amazing feedback about it. So we really do try and innovate and see what our patients are looking for. And being a smaller organization, we can really bring that to market pretty quickly. So we really try and pride ourselves on, you know, being that cutting edge and bringing new things to market.

Lisa Buffo  34:15

That’s that’s cool. I gotta find one and try some. Now. How big are they? Like?

Keri Branch  34:20

Little like a marble, okay, marble, yeah, I’ll send you a picture.

Lisa Buffo  34:24

Okay, yeah, yeah, that would be awesome. But when we launched

Keri Branch  34:28

it, there’s plenty of people that are not familiar with it, so in marketing, we brought that out with a content piece that we pushed out through text and email and through social so people could learn about it, and, you know, winds up on Reddit and things like that. And those who are in the solvent list, you know, that’s their category, that’s what they love. They help spread the word, so it really kind of spreads like wildfire, which is really nice. So we’re able to use that passion that our customers have for. For us, for that brand and for what we do, and really leverage that to have them talking about what we do as well. So it’s really, it’s exciting to see things like that happen pretty organically.

Lisa Buffo  35:12

Yeah, that? I mean, that’s every marketer’s dream. And can you when you say content piece like, was it a blog post? Because I would imagine, if this that obviously sounds like and is something that an experienced user would consume that with just a little bit of information, they would pick up on it and, Oh, I get it. You know, that makes sense, where there is that education gap, but in terms of maybe the first evangelists, or those who understood it and started talking about it, would digest that pretty quickly, I’m assuming. But like, what was that content piece when you when you say that is, is it like a blog post that you’re sending out? Is it a series of pieces of content? Yeah, tell me about how you introduce that.

Keri Branch  35:54

So we did introduce it with a blog piece, and we also did a sub like a supplemental blog piece, just on concentrates in general. So that this was really interesting, but we knew it was for experienced users. And so that was not you, but you found it interesting, but you wanted to see what would be, maybe your skill level, then you would find this for you. So we actually did two pieces together so it provided information for kind of everyone. So if this, if temple balls were not for you, but you wanted to see what concentrates for, and so you had two pieces that went together, and we pushed them out at the launch happened,

Lisa Buffo  36:32

yeah, that’s that’s awesome. That’s anticipating follow up questions and giving a decision tree to the folks who would receive that so they can they can learn more. Well, while we’re speaking about education, do you have any other examples or any other best practices you’ve learned about how you approach educating potential customers about your products, and any other thoughts on like how to do that while staying compliant, because I know you obviously can’t make health claims, but you a product like a temple ball, you have to just at least, at a minimum, describe what it does like, how you have a general framework or philosophy towards consumer customer education.

Keri Branch  37:14

So I think one of the things that I find most frustrating about the program, and I think it, I think it relates to Pennsylvania and a lot of other markets, but Pennsylvania in particular, like Massachusetts, you can go in and you can see jars, you can see the flower, you can kind of smell it. But in our industry, you can’t do that. In Pennsylvania, everything is, you know, in a jar behind the counter, it’s just that they’re available to see, let alone if you have questions or you’re not really sure if this is for you. It’s not like buying a sweater or sneakers. You can’t go in ask questions, look at it. It’s just different, right? So what we try and do is make ourselves as accessible as possible, and try and spread that word. So we try and get out to as many community events as we can to show we’re accessible. We also try and promote the fact that Pennsylvania, unlike most states, we keep a pharmacist on site at all times. So even if you just want to call in and ask questions, the pharmacist is there. You’re coming in for your first visit, or your 100 and first visit, the pharmacist is there your medical health your medications change all the time, and we want to be there to walk you through that process, no matter where you are. No question is a silly question. We want you to know that we’re there to support you through your health journey no matter what, whether you’re doing it for fun, for a serious medical condition, or just need a better night’s sleep, or to lower your anxiety during a specific time, or overall, you just need a better quality of life. We’re always going to be there to support you, and whether that is by providing the educational articles on the website, telling you a little bit more about the research we’re doing with Penn State College of Medicine, and keeping you up to date on the advances that are happening there. We just try and meet the patient where they are by providing a number of different outlets and telling them where we are and what we’re doing, so just trying to meet them where they are and listening to where they would like us to be. So we’re always kind of in our Instagram account and answering questions there we’re out in the community and making ourselves as available as possible at the dispensaries and keeping them as open as we can while being compliant

Lisa Buffo  39:31

and having the on site pharmacist. Is that a regulation or a business choice?

Keri Branch  39:35

It is a regulation. However, the regulations did change a little over a year ago, where they didn’t necessarily have to be on site. You can do them by phone now, and pharmacists can support multiple locations. We have made the business decision to keep a pharmacist on site at all locations, because we think it is really important. Important for patients to have that access

Lisa Buffo  40:03

that, yeah, that’s that makes a lot of sense. Well, that explains a lot about education. That’s a great one great way to do it. Can you also share an example of a successful so, kind of getting back to campaigns and different ways to reach consumers. Any examples of successful marketing campaigns that you’ve run, and what made it, what made them effective?

Keri Branch  40:26

I think one that is different than the typical campaigns that are are that I’ve seen in the state we did what I know to be one of the first bounce back campaigns, something it’s really typical in retail, like Kohl’s cash. I think everybody’s kind of heard of that, right, but we implemented it for dispensaries. It’s kind of an old school way of doing it, but we do have an older average age for our patients here in PA and so we decided to give it a shot about a year ago and see how it went the we presented it to the Department of Health and said, Does this fall? Because sometimes, like, the way our regulations are written, you can’t tell, like, will this idea fall within this regulation? And so you just kind of have to present it to them and say, Does this fall? Are you okay? If we do this, it’s kind of like asking Mom Dad, are you okay? Yeah. And, and they said, Yep, this falls within the regulation, um. And so we tried it, and our patients really liked it, so we set up the program where we knew we would have an influx of traffic during a particular week. And so if you bought a certain amount, you got this coupon, and it was $10 a purchase in a future week, when we know traffic would die down because we had been heavier here. So we set it up very strategically to bring the traffic back in when we wanted to see it. And we actually saw a really good return rate. So we knew patients liked it. We learned things along the way. We’ve done it a couple times now, so we’ve gotten a little bit more strategic about the reminders, like, hey, don’t forget to come in and get your bounce back. So it definitely continues to drive them in on that busy week, which is when we’re running heavier sales, or things are happening that we want them to come in for and then putting up, hey, this is your week to redeem. And each time we’ve done it, we’ve seen increased redemption rates, which to us that tells us the patients are liking it, enjoying it, and it’s staying within the margins that we want to so we continue to do it and continue to tweak the formula to say these are the times we want to do it to supplement either driving traffic or driving sound through whatever it is that we’re looking to do, we can tweak the formula to have it work. But to me, it’s an old idea that you’re able to reuse within this industry, and it’s something we really hadn’t seen happen yet that our patients are really enjoying.

Lisa Buffo  42:59

Yeah, that’s that’s cool. It is so much about working in marketing. In this space requires you to be really open minded and think creatively and come up with new ideas and interesting solutions. But I love that that’s a older way of doing things, but it it works for your audience, and it and people, it also means that they’re paying attention. And that’s engagement is really, I mean, that’s a form of measuring customer engagement is okay, I know to come here get this and come back then and time it out and space it and obviously reminders help. But that’s a that’s that seems like a win win across the board, and

Keri Branch  43:38

for us, it creates a shopping pattern. So if we know they’re coming in once to get it, they’re coming in twice to redeem it, and most likely, then we’re going to see them a third or a fourth time, and that’s what we’re continuing to measure over time. Because for us, if we can bring them back three four times, then we know we’re creating a pattern or a habit, or hopefully, we’re going to become the dispensary that they’re loyal to, right? It just becomes your regular store that you’re always at, and that’s what we’re after in the long term. So a lot of the things that we do, it’s we want to become the dispensary that you know, you trust, we have the knowledgeable associates. But can we become that regular dispensary that you’re at on a weekly by the weekly basis, whatever your you know, your preferences, or, you know, tracking what they’re they’re doing. So I think this is something that contributes to it. One of our text campaigns, we found we’ve got a really good points program. It’s one of the most financially beneficial for patients in Pennsylvania. Our existing patients love it, but they tend to forget what day they get double points, which is part of the program. So we started a campaign where we included in our text before we didn’t do that, we already had high traffic on the day that was double points. When we doubled down and said, Let’s do a campaign if they’re not sure when the double points are, let’s lean in and try and create the habit where they know what day it is. We. Found that we had an 85% open rate on, I’m sorry, click through, rate on the text messages that had the reminder for the double points the 30% higher than any other one we had sent over, like, three months. It just so we’re like, this is definitely content they want to see. So if we do it, we’re automatically going to take advantage of, you know, that day that that sale, that program that is already in place. We don’t have to do anything additional for it. We’re reinforcing a program we know they already love. We’re seeing good results from it, and hopefully they’re going to continue to open the text messages as we send and see what else is happening later in the week. And that tends to be what we’re seeing happening. So it’s taking advantage of something that’s already there. It’s creating a pattern we want. We’re seeing good results from it.

Lisa Buffo  45:51

That’s really cool. That’s really cool to hear. Well, last question I have for you, what trends or changes do you see for the future of marketing, and this could be specific to medical it could be specific to Pennsylvania. It could just be industry specific. But given your your deep experience that you’ve had at these businesses, like, where, where do you see the future, and how would you advise someone getting into this space, like, what, how should they think about what the next few years might look like?

Keri Branch  46:24

I honestly think over the next couple years, we’re going to get closer and closer to what actual retail is, and I think we’re already seeing it. And I think with the rescheduling, it’s going to get closer and closer. I think what I’m excited to see hopefully with the rescheduling and 280 going away, is an increase in budget. So hopefully for us, the budget is closer to when we were in prior industries, but opening up new marketing channels too, you know, allowing us to advertise in places we weren’t able to, and really kind of leveling the playing field for those we’re competing against. And I’m really hopeful that we’ll see interstate commerce. I think that’s something that can really change the face of our industry and really provide patients with the best medicine that they can get. I think while it’s really great to, you know, grow something locally and be able to consume it locally, I do think it is hard and frustrating if you find a product somewhere, and then you go home and you can’t have it again, or it’s just not the same. Or, you know, those restrictions can be really difficult on patients. Yeah, that all the time. So I think being able to open up interstate commerce will really change the face of what we can offer and what we can market and how these companies are organized. So I think that’s a change that is coming, and could be really exciting for all of us and for patients and for how we do what we do every day. And really hopefully that will get Pennsylvania recreational. So that’s something I think that really excited to see for us locally, and could really change things. You know, we often say that Pennsylvania is a medical is like a recreational state, kind of, you know, pretending that it’s medical. We have so many people here, I think that are so ready for it, and I think that is how we would operate best, is being able to offer it to, you know, both audiences that are really being able to use it both ways. And I think being in this industry long enough, you know that whether you’ve got your Med card for one thing or another. You’re definitely using it for multiple things at this point, the plan is amazing. It has so many benefits, and being able to open that up would make a big difference for a lot of people.

Lisa Buffo  48:52

Yeah. Well, Carrie, I really appreciate you taking the time to share your insight and join us on the show. Do you have any like your LinkedIn email, social for yourself or the business, so our followers can follow along or learn more about you, or vital options.

Keri Branch  49:10

So I am on LinkedIn, you can find me there, vital. We’re vital. Pa, on Instagram, you can follow us there. We try and be very social and active on there, and you can find me on Instagram as well. So try and be very active with what we’re doing and where we’re going. We’ll actually be at a Cresco event later tonight, trying to support them. So we try and stay very active in the community in the industry, and we look forward to seeing more of you out and about,

Lisa Buffo  49:42

and it’s vital with a why for everybody listening. Yeah, we’ll link it in the show notes. But yeah, vital, vital with a Y in PA, well, Carrie, I really appreciate you. Thank you so much for coming and speaking with me today.

Keri Branch  49:54

Thank you so much, Lisa. It was a pleasure being here.

Lisa Buffo  49:57

Thank you everybody for tuning. In please subscribe to this podcast. We’re also on YouTube, where you can see the video version. And if you’d like to connect with the CMA community, please visit us at the Cannabis Marketing association.com or on social media at Canna marketing. You can also sign up for our newsletter on our website to stay up to date with new episodes, tools, insight, blog posts and more from the CMA community, and hear from our members. And if you’re interested in learning more about membership or becoming a guest on the show, please reach out to our team at membership, at marketing cannabis.org, see you next week.